# The pivot tag is being used for two completely unrelated things - should I try to separate them?

I'm not sure what the right approach is in this case (and there are a few similar cases in other tags).

The tag pivot seems to be being used for both 'pivotal quantities' and 'pivot tables' (as in Excel). The first use of it seems to have been related to pivotal quantities, but it's been used about equally for both.

As such, I think the 'find similar questions' use of tags is somewhat compromised, since half the 'pivot' hits you will get will be the other meaning.

Might it make more sense to set up 'pivotal-quantity' and 'pivot-table' tags and edit so that the two are separated (perhaps making pivot a synonym of one of them)?

That would, of course, involve editing the tags on the existing questions with the tag.

On the other hand, it's not a heavily used tag (11 times I think), so perhaps its okay to just leave it.

I'm not sure what the reasonable thing to do is, so I figured I'd ask.

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Edit: Taking into account @gung's concern about large scale changes to tags being disruptive, here's my plan:

1) Right now -

a) give the ~half-dozen questions that have the pivot tag but aren't about pivotal quantities have the pivot-table tag (thus changing only about five or six tags at once) [done]

b) make a tag wiki for pivot to say it's for pivotal quantities and mentioning the existence of the pivot-table tag [done]

c) make a tag wiki for pivot-table [done]

(at this point, the tag situation is 'stable' in the sense that it's clear to users what to do, if somewhat imperfect)

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In the future (if needed)

2) At some time later on -

a) make a pivotal-quantity tag

b) make a tag-wiki for it

c) edit tags on the remaining ~5-6 posts to make it pivotal-quantity

d) edit the pivot tag wiki to mention the use of the other two tags

e) reserve the pivot tag for pivoting in the matrix calculation (Gaussian elimination etc) sense, and perhaps the pivot-element in quicksort sense, both of which have some relevance to statistics (but retaining the note about the other two tags)

OR

3) Alternative to (2) if pivot becomes widely used and the matrix sense is needed -

a) make a pivot-element tag

b) make a tag-wiki for it

c) edit tags on any pivot posts that should have this tag instead

d) edit the pivot tag wiki to also mention the use of the new tag

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* Edit2: In carrying out stage 1, I struck the following quandary - This post is tagged as pivot ... and at first glance I had thought it was connected to pivot-tables, but now I am not at all sure it is. In fact I can't work out how the term pivot comes into it at all. Should it be retagged as some other kind of thing? [Fixed by @gung]

• @AndreSilva It looks like gung fixed it in a sensible way, so that problem is resolved. – Glen_b Jun 30 '13 at 3:10
• Regarding the post in Edit2, I voted to close. The post doesn't make a whole lot of sense; the comments ask for clarification & point out some obvious issues, to which the OP responds that the question is resolved. I think it's a prime candidate for too localized, which is no longer an option for closing, but I still think it should be closed. – gung - Reinstate Monica Jun 30 '13 at 3:34
• Thanks guys for taking care of that! – chl Jun 30 '13 at 9:44
• @Glen_b, I update the answer to address your solution to the question. Feel free to edit the answer or post a new one according you think it is the best approach. Thank's. – Andre Silva Jun 30 '13 at 11:30

I thing your arguments (1 to 5, listed bellow) are very valid. Added arguments 6 and 7.

1. "..pivot seems to be being used for both 'pivotal quantities' and 'pivot tables'"- Check;
2. ".. I think the 'find similar questions' use of tags is somewhat compromised.." - Check;
3. "....make more sense to set up 'pivotal-quantity' and 'pivot-table' tags..." - Check;
4. "...perhaps making pivot a synonym of one of them..." - Check;
5. "... it's not a heavily used tag (11 times I think)..." - Check; (this is not a counter argument IMO, but supports the idea it is easier to fix it now).
6. Glen_b is a experienced user of CV - Check;
7. It is weekend and CV's traffic is very slow; - ?

Just one comment is that "pivot table" does not seem to be a statistic subject, so it could fit under other tags, for example, excel. This is one example.

Proposal:

i) create pivotal-quantity, and make pivot a synonym;
ii) add at the pivot's tag excerpt (.."do not use this tag for pivot-table");
iii) remove the pivot tag from pivot-table questions, and certifies this questions will have the tag excel;

UPDATE: Implemented by @Glen_b, with community approval.

1) Right now -

a) give the ~half-dozen questions that have the pivot tag but aren't about pivotal quantities have the pivot-table tag (thus changing only about five or six tags at once) [done]

b) make a tag wiki for pivot to say it's for pivotal quantities and mentioning the existence of the pivot-table tag [done]

c) make a tag wiki for pivot-table [done]

(at this point, the tag situation is 'stable' in the sense that it's clear to users what to do, if somewhat imperfect)

• +1. However, I do think that editing a large number of questions @ 1 time can be disruptive, so the fact that it's only 11, & traffic is slow are arguments in favor. I also think that questions about pivot tables are close enough to data analysis to be on-topic for CV & so should have a dedicated tag. – gung - Reinstate Monica Jun 29 '13 at 15:45
• @gung I agree that pivot tables are on topic and should have a tag of their own - it's a particular kind of data summary (I'm not a particular fan of the term, but it's certainly widely used). – Glen_b Jun 29 '13 at 23:44
• @gung I have made a list at the end of my question with a plan of how to do it that should halve the disruption by doing it in two stages, each of which leaves things stable. Stage one (which I am doing now) involves only retagging the 5 or 6 items which discuss pivot-tables. Stage 2 is simply a proposal for what to do later and suggestions on it are welcome. – Glen_b Jun 30 '13 at 0:14
• @Glen_b, given the slow traffic rate on the main site right now, I think 5-6 retaggings is perfectly fine. I would just delete the old tag & add the appropriate tag in its place. – gung - Reinstate Monica Jun 30 '13 at 1:45
• @Glen_b, re: what to do later, if you are thinking of 3 distinct pivot concepts, your plan seems right. @ 1st, I thought you were thinking of just 2, in which case, pivot-table & pivot for pivotal-quantity seems best. – gung - Reinstate Monica Jun 30 '13 at 2:07
• @gung Yes, my apologies; I realized after my first post there was at least a third possibility and modified things. I am not sure if it's necessary though. In any case there doesn't seem to be a rush on that part. – Glen_b Jun 30 '13 at 2:10
• @gung so as things stand right at this moment, pivot-table and pivot exist, and at this point I'll probably leave it as it stands until we have a need for a third (which I expect will happen). If pivot gets a lot of pivotal quantity posts by then, the new term could be pivot-element; if it's still sitting around 5 or 6, then the scheme in my question could be implemented. – Glen_b Jun 30 '13 at 3:14
• @gung I have modified my post to update it with that alternative – Glen_b Jun 30 '13 at 3:20